Information on So. Fla. copied from board

Posted By: Steve Williams
Date: 10/26/99 7:37a.m.

Report: outside forum guidelines

Posted By: cindy > Date: 10/17/99 5:16pm we are heading to the Florida keys this Feb, and are looking for a good marina to stay at. we have a sovereign 18. last year we stayed at pennecamp coral reef state park. it's great there but we would like to see the bay side. anyone know any good spots. we have a 22" fixed shoal draft keel, so we can go just about anywhere. Posted By: Charles Brennan, Windrose18, So.Fla. > Date: 10/17/99 6:16pm Cindy, I'm too much of an anarchist, to stay in an organized facility like a marina, but there are quite a number of them, the only problem being that the vast majority are on the ocean side. Any good Keys guide lists them, and the chamber of commerce is not at all shy ballyhooing them at http://www.fl-keys.com and similar web-sites. The few gulf side marinas cater heavily to powerboats and tourist attractions (parasails, ultralights, jet skis, sailfish, and hobie cats, etc.), as reflected in their facilities. I personally like the middle keys, and generally stay in the Marathon area. Places like Duck Key, Little Palm Key and the like, while on ocean side, have reasonable access to the gulf side. If you can un-step and re-step your mast in the water, then your options are unlimited, and you could stay anywhere. Looe Key is great for snorkeling and diving alike, although February might be wetsuit weather. The gulf side is great for steady sailing, and is unaffected for the most part by winter fronts that kick up waves on the reef outside, but unless you get pretty far into the back country northeast of Key West, there is not much to see. If you're up for a trip to it, Everglades National Park has a ramp and marina at Flamingo, and your shoal draft would make a trip across Florida Bay to Cape Sable, easily. It would be a good part of the day there, and a long night back, or better still an overnight trip. You could also run from Marathon to Cape Sable and back, but you're talking most of a long day in each direction. The other nice thing, is that with the wind from the northeast or east, you're talking one long reach, both directions. In the winter, there are an incredible number of birds out there from all over the world; the vegetation looks white from a distance, and then you realize it's because it is covered over by tens of thousands of birds. At sunset, the sounds of all those birds, followed by our world-class sunsets, makes for an incredible experience. It is also very secluded, if mankind is kinda crowding in on you, like happens to me sometimes. Very mellowing place. Check it out. Charles Brennan Bahia Honda State Park is another excellent suggestion, although as I said before, I have way too many problems with authority figures, to stay there myself. There is a ramp near there that is suitable for sailboats. BTW, for anybody trailer/sailing the Keys, don't get too cocky about your shoal draft keels. Don't forget to look up! Some of the ramps look good until you notice they have power lines in the worst possible place. Long Key State Park is another nice place to stay and is on the east side of the "Fish Bowl of the Keys" (Long Key Viaduct) There are private ramps on both sides of the viaduct. Right before Vaca Cut (which is just before you get into Marathon) there is a public ramp. I sometimes like to put the boat in there, then rent a room at one of the motels across the street. They are very understanding about leaving your trailer there, if you're checked in. Then you can sail all day, and still get a hot shower, and sleep in air-conditioning that night. Down side is the prices, since Nov. - Apr. is the height of the season. The real point is, there are numerous options down here, the real trick is to figure out what you want to do, in the time allotted you for a vacation. 20 some-odd years sailing south Florida and the Keys, and there are still trips I've dreamed up that I want to make: like sailing to Fort Jefferson in the Dry Tortugas (a 75 mile trip to the middle of nowhere, how cool!) or seeing how far into the 10,000 Islands you could get a sailboat (and still get back out!). So much water, so little time! Posted By: Rick Waldbart > Date: 10/18/99 2:02pm The area now known as the Ten Thousand Islands are roughly the area between Marco Island Florida and Everglades City Florida. It's fairly likely that a portion of what is now the Everglades National Park was also informally included in the general area in the past. These days, I usually put in at Port of the Islands marina, then head out the channel there. I've got a couple favorite anchorage’s that will keep me out of the weather...then just hang out, relax, sail if I feel like it. I'm sailing a Sea Pearl 28' "Belle" with 19" draft. Most of my real exploring was done with the SP 21, there in the 10,000 islands and Everglades Posted By: David > Date: 10/18/99 1:36pm are there marinas down there where you can put your boat in and leave your truck and trailer. Posted By: Rick Waldbart > Date: 10/18/99 2:02pm I put in at Port of the Islands Marina, and have for probably at least 10 years, and leave my vehicle there for up to two weeks at a time. There are also marinas in E. City but I haven't used them. If you are *very* shallow draft, like 6 to 12 inches, there is Collier-Seminole Park, also a safe place to leave a vehicle. There are marinas in Marco too, but I haven't used them. The POI is so close, so convenient that it's hard to pass up for me. >Where is Port of the Islands marina? You have been close, just go further south on Highway 41, a few miles past Collier-Seminole Park. POI is a marina/motel complex (the motel part is under rehab at the moment) on the right side of the road. Really, you can't miss it. Highway 41 splits from a two lane to a four lane highway right there were the highway crosses a canal. Looking back over your shoulder, it's easy to see that there's a marina there. < How far back into the 10,000 islands have you gotten? We might have to pore over some charts to answer this. The real answer is a long way. Keep in mind that, coming south, as a guy enters the 10K Islands "from" Collier-Seminole, he's already pretty "deep", of what I'm saying is clear. As you "enter" the area from POI, same thing, since you're really coming "out" to the coastal region where the all those islands really are. You could go off the channel there anywhere you wish, tide permitting. What's your draft? Mast height is significant, but it's more important to know whether or not you can step it in the water. (I think you, or someone just pointed this out in another post.) Then there's the Fakahatchee area. You can "approach" it from either the pass that runs near "Round Key" or "Float Key", which is reasonably isolated, or E. City...but to go from Fakahatchee *to* E. City directly, takes something like the SP 21 with very shallow draft, or a kayak. I've done both, to answer your question. *Then* there's all of the Everglades itself. I've been all over and through the area with a sea kayak. Through most if it, the exception is the "Nightmare", with the SP 21. As I said, I usually just hang out with the 28. I want much more time than I usually have these days to go "get lost" with the bigger boat. I know what you mean about being brave. Lots of the exploration have been with another guy, paddling kayak, but in recent years it's been solo...and it can get pretty spooky out there for me. Maybe some folks don't feel that way, but I always did. Funny, though, almost all of the really "deep" trips I made were without GPS. Got one now, and I agree, that's really a help. > I'd be a little braver nowadays, as long as the GPS batteries held >up. I got far enough back there once to >see bobcat tracks, but couldn't go further, due to all the overhang >from cypress and mangroves. Probably the deepest I ever went was in the Lostman's River area. I just followed one of those creeks off the charts, but I had some orthophoto maps to go by. It didn't really matter, I knew I was in a fairly well defined stream bed. Hard to get lost if you can tell which way the current is flowing...and can factor in the tides...heh, heh. > Is it really clear enough back >country to get in there with 27 feet of mast? In many places, impossible...step the mast. In others it's fine. I once saw a guy take his 65' up the Shark River a *very* long way. This is further down in the Eglades, now, I'm speaking of. He has a *lot* more than 27' of mast! > Might have been pruned by one of the hurricanes or something. I think the area is always in a state of flux. To tell you the truth, I'm always pleasantly surprised at how accurate the charts are. I've heard lots of folks say that they aren't but I don't believe it. I think the faster you go, powerboats, the easier it is to lose track of where you are. Posted By: John Cop > Date: 10/19/99 5:20am There is also a marina on the Baron River (I think it is the Baron River Marina) in Northern Everglades City right off the major road down from Ft. Meyers. We found the place on the Internet (don't know if they still have a site). The place is a bit of a dive, but the operators were very nice and it was inexpensive. It has two ramps - there is a current there so retrieval is more interesting than normal but no big deal. It was also easy to get to - about a half hour? (its been 3 years) south of Ft. Meyers. You are about a 40 min motor up the Baron River from the Gulf and it puts you out right in the northern part of the 1,000 Islands area. We headed north, but when we do it again (not this year, unfortunately) we will probably go south. There were lots of very protected anchorage’s that we had to ourselves. You may need a GPS - the whole area looks the same (green mangrove) and it is VERY easy to miss marks - its not the easiest place to keep track of where you are. We took our brand new boat on its maiden voyage for this trip. When we launched and tied up for the first night (it was almost dark by that time), we heard a snap - crackel - pop all night long. We thought the boat hull was dissolving - never heard a noise like that before. We never heard it again until we tied up the last night before pull out. Someone told us it was the shrimp banging against the hull in the current. They have a restaurant and there is a small grocer within walking distance. We would use the place again. The other place that knows all about trailer sailors (a large group of the Michigan contingent use this every year) is Uncle Henry's on Gasprarilla Island (near Boca Raton?). In fact, if you identify yourself as a trailorsailor, they may give you a discount. This puts you in the Charlotte Harbor area. We did this last year and were somewhat disappointed with the area although there is more to do with regard to restaurants and such. Vastly preferred waters south of there. Posted By: Rick Waldbart > Date: 10/19/99 6:03am Boy, you're jogging my memory! >There is also a marina on the Baron River (I think it is the Baron >River Marina) in Northern Everglades City right off the major road >down from Ft. Meyers...(snip) It has two ramps - there is a current >there so retrieval is more interesting than >normal but no big deal. You're right, Everglades City does have some marina(s). Further out there's a public ramp just past the causeway to Chokoloskee. Better have pretty shallow draft though...and there's a private outfit on Chokoloskee itself. If memory serves correctly, it doesn't have a ramp but a sling lift...about 1000 lb capacity at the time I asked ...which was at least 10 years ago. > It was also easy to get to - about a half >hour? (its been 3 years) >south of Ft. Meyers. Yep, you're right, closer to an hour. All these are pretty good places, but I have to drive right by Port of the Islands as I come south on Highway 41, so that's a bit closer, the ramp is perfect, and there's no current at all, though I agree that the current in the Barron R isn't all that tough. >You are about a 40 min motor up the Baron River from the Gulf and it >puts you out right in the northern part of the 1,000 Islands area. Yes, Indian Key Pass, the main pass, but by no means the only pass from the area drops you out close to the northern most boundary of the Everglades Park, and the southern most boundary of the newly designated Ten Thousand Islands Area. Long before the park, it was probably *all* the 10,000 Islands. >We headed north, but when we do it again (not this year, >unfortunately) we will probably go south. There were lots of very >protected >anchorage’s that we had to ourselves. North, south, there is so much to see and check out if you want a bit of solitude. > You may need a GPS - the whole area looks the same (green mangrove) >and it is VERY easy >to miss marks - its not the easiest place to keep track of where you >are. You're right. At the same time it's also pretty easy to keep an idea of where the Gulf is. When we were paddling kayaks it seemed easier to get lost since we were so much further inland. With the shallow draft boats, it's a bit easier to simply keep the Gulf in mind. Does get spooky, though, hunh? >We took our brand new boat on its maiden voyage for this trip. When >we launched and tied up for the first night (it was almost dark >by that time), we heard a snap - crackel - pop all night long. We >thought the boat hull was dissolving - never heard a noise like that >before. We never heard it again until we tied up the last night >before pull out. Someone told us it was the shrimp banging against >the hull in the current. I've heard it many times too, though I've heard that it was the shrimp's motion in the water as opposed to banging against the hull. Who knows? The other place that knows all about trailer sailors (a large group of the Michigan contingent use this every year) is Uncle Henry's on Gasprarilla Island (near Boca Raton?). Boca Grande. Boca Raton is in the Ft Lauderdale area, the other coast. >This puts you in >the Charlotte Harbor area. We did this last year and were somewhat >disappointed with the area although there is more to do with >regard to restaurants and such. Vastly preferred waters south of >there. Yep, Charlotte Harbor is different. Lots more development. Good in some ways if that's one's interest. I have been in the little 'keyhole' just north of Cabbage Key...did you find that? Just on the south end of Cayo Blanco I think. My own preference is the Ten Thousand Island/Everglades/Florida Bay. Been going down there 20 years and *still* haven't gotten tired of it. Posted By: John Cop > Date: 10/19/99 9:21am Cabbage Key - yup - did that. In fact, one of our anchors is still there. Restaurant near there with all the dollar bills is worth checking our. We found Calybourn's guide to be very useful for both trips. Never had trouble finding the gulf, but had to really pay attention to pick up the channel to the Baron River and to identify which area the anchorage we were attempting to find was. If memory serves, the Baron River Marina (?) is as far up river as a sailboat can go. I think there was a low clearance bridge just up river almost next to the ramp. I don't remember how much water was there, but, from the size of the boats I remember being docked there, it had to be 3 or 4 feet anyway. Posted By: Rick Waldbart > Date: 10/19/99 11:03am >Never had trouble finding the gulf, but had to really pay attention >to pick up the channel to the Baron River and to identify which area >the anchorage we were attempting to find was. Yes. I meant more keeping an idea of where the open water is as you go exploring some of the many unmarked passes or channels up and down the coast. >If memory serves, the Baron River Marina (?) is as far up river as a >sailboat can go. I think there was a low clearance bridge just up >river almost next to the ramp. I don't remember how much water was >there, but, from the size of the boats I remember being docked >there, it had to be 3 or 4 feet anyway. I'm sure you're probably right. I meant further on down the road through Everglades city, you come to a causeway that joins what once was an island, Chokoloskee, to the mainland. That's where the public ramp is, and lots of very shallow water, and the privat e one with the sling. There's just a little encircling channel around, maybe just partially around that island. Easy exit is "Sand Fly (Flea?) Pass", further south from the main pass you go in for the Baron river. At some tides I'd bet it'd be pretty tough to even get to the main channel in. Posted By: Bruce Cain > Date: 10/18/99 1:50pm Charles, I have to agree with you on all your ideas about sailing in the Keys. I have tried it ocean side and bay side and I think the bay side is best. I had a C-22 that I would trailer down from Orlando area and spend 3-4 days anchored out in the bay or around Cape Sable and Sand Key. The keys are there so you can resupply and take an occasional shower and sleep in a soft bed, other than that they are more hassle than they are worth. To many Yankees moving down there than complaining about how crowded and polluted it is becoming. Good sailing... Posted By: Jobst Vandrey > Date: 10/18/99 5:13pm I found Sea Bird Marina on the Bay Side at Long Key a nice place to stay. I day sailed out of there for a week and then left my car and trailer there for the next two weeks while I ventured on the Key West and the Marquesa Keys. The car and trailer storage was nice since it was in a locked and gated area. Details on my web site under the Florida cruise section. Posted By: Rick Waldbart > Date: 10/19/99 2:40pm On your way down, check out a marina at about marker 80.5, bay side. The name used to be "Vic's". It used to be a really old beat up place, very friendly local fireman owned and operated it as a marina, sort of.Last time I checked it had been completely rehabbed to what looked like a 'trailer sailor' paradise... camp slots located dock side and so forth.let me know, I'd bet I can dig up some info if it is of any interest. From there, I once visited Rabbit Key and Nest Key.